f-22 vs su-37
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f-22 vs su-37
Thursday, January 27, 2005 (9:04 PM)

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Posted by
Sukhoy (488)
Edit
RE: f-22 vs su-37
Posted: January 27, 2010 (6:13 AM)
:) tell me please how it works with those ranges. . as I can see in wiki. .F-22 has only 400miles range, Su-37 850 miles aprox. Only with external fuel it has more. But wearing external fuel it is not stealth anymore.

If you think it can use air-refueling than you maybe wrong because in air combat a good pilot will shoot down AWACS and Tankers, so there is no need to fight against F-22, which indeed it has lower RCS.

Think about missiles ranges and the maximum ranges are only theoretical. If a missile has 150km range than it has a change to hit an aircraft from maybe 50km. USAF doesn't have long-range missiles like K-172 or R-37 which in tests hit the target at 300km range. K-172 has a maximum theoretical range 1000Km but it is recomanded to use it up to 400Km and against large planes like tankers and awacs.

Again don't compare 5th gen aircraft against 4th gen aircraft. Please compare F-15 vs Su-xx, it is more fair. F-22 has the first change to win, but su-37 is closely to it I think.


Posted by
SnrFreebie (1)
Edit
RE: f-22 vs su-37
Posted: January 27, 2010 (5:59 PM)
"The scenario is only what it is, a scenario. In reality tankers wont even be a factor because F-22s have been in Okinawa since 07. The airspace the raptors need to cover to intercept the opfor aggressors are less than 400 miles. F-22 range is 1800 miles. Keep dreaming about how Sus, Migs or Eurofighters can beat the F-22s, but it aint happening anytime soon."

The range you're quoting there is actually the ferry range. That is the distance an F-22 can fly between friendly airfields. That means no weaponry + external tanks and it is a one way trip.

The combat radius is less then half that and half again typically for US aircraft if you remove the external tanks.

The F-22 has an ingeniously designed unaerodynamic shape which kinda hits the air like a hammer so it has overpowered engines to hit that air hard enough to stay in the air. The problem with that is the fuel consumption. The F-15 has a far superior range then the F-22 due to a more aerodynamic (yet not stealth) design. It is the true air superiority aircraft because it can stay in the air for some time and the Flanker series were designed to compete with that. The F-22a fits into a nice little niche left open by the last generation, where their radars and BVR and fuel capacity and agility mean little. However in order to utilise this gap you need exceptional mission planning, good intel, radar, tanking etc.

In fact you pretty much need flukish luck. You keep on saying "If you cant see them, you cant beat them." while the majority of air to air battles against equals occur either at visual range or by accidental radar contact. This is because equals deploy across the same geographic scale (in other words thinly). And in this environment the LAST thing a paranoid fighter pilot is going to do is turn his radar on and light himself up to every electronic warfare asset within 400km. So basically your F-22A's are going to rely, at best, on occasional AWACS use or maybe an intermittent 'dummy' radar surrounded by allied planes.

The problem is, all these scenarios will eventually play out, as in most battles of equals these days in the air, with pilots turning tail and running for home the moment BVR missiles get fired. Its just not practical or sensible to stick around in that kind of airspace.

So the only scenario thats going to result in a combat win, is when 2 planes, radars off, accidentally run into each other and have a knife fight. And in that scenario, fuel + engine capacity + wing area + IRST suite + WVR missiles are the only important design factors.


Posted by
FlyingHigh5 (4)
Edit
RE: f-22 vs su-37
Posted: January 28, 2010 (9:36 PM)
They had a simulation and because the Su-35's are so cheap they can mass produce compared to the F-22 (by the way stop talking about the Su-37 as if it is real - they discontinued it without any planes integrated into their military other than for testing) it was 72 Su-35's vs 6 F-22. The F-22 shot down 27 Su-35 but the Su-35s destroyed the american fuel tanker. The F-22s did not sustain any losses otherwise but when all is said and done the F-22s were probably out of missiles and in hostile lands without fuel. I am american and I truely think the F-22 is a better plane but being the better plane doesnt mean you can win. Sometimes quality does lose to quanity and i believe this would be one of thoses cases. Unless of course the F-22s can flee faster than the Su-35s which in this case would be close to obselete. The F-22 is faster but not by much and with the range on the Su-35's missiles it would shoot them down without a problem.
When all is said and done america can not produce nearly enough F-22s fast enough and not have enough money for which by the way the F-22s have been cancelled and are being kept up. Looking forward to the F-42 with space capabilities

Posted by
FlyingHigh5 (4)
Edit
RE: f-22 vs su-37
Posted: January 28, 2010 (9:50 PM)
By the way this thread really will never end the russians and USA air forces both have very very different builds and each time they fight there will always be different senerioes, so we can keep coming up with more factors that would say whose better but truthfully in their own ways their both equal and unless they actually fight which wont happen anytime soon before an even more advanced fighter plane comes out. Another problem is americans and russians are both fiercely prideful and unwilling to admit defeat. that was proved in the cold war, not saying that americas better but i do know one thing, when these two planes go head to head it doesnt matter how good the planes are if the pilots piloting them are inadequete. It was proven in the korean war. The MiG-16s were better than the F-100 Sabers but the americans had piloting experience from WW II therefore able to have a kill ratio of 17 killed to every 1 lost. So let me get to the point too many factors to bring into this theologically and we are too proud and too hard headed to give in and admit defeat.

Posted by
FlyingHigh5 (4)
Edit
RE: f-22 vs su-37
Posted: January 28, 2010 (9:52 PM)
By the way forgot to add that this post has been going on for almost 5 years just to prove my point.

Posted by
FlyingHigh5 (4)
Edit
RE: f-22 vs su-37
Posted: January 28, 2010 (10:09 PM)
By the way and I don't know this from russian views but i know the USA is more into developing unmanned aircraft there for able to go faster and make more manuevers that the body cannot handle therefor giving it the advantage. As i stated a second ago i cannot speak on the russians behalf because this was just a thought and i have no research on russians unmanned reserach.

Posted by
mugen (1)
Edit
RE: f-22 vs su-37
Posted: November 29, 2010 (2:51 PM)
2 b clear n honest. aside from all this steath crap we r not talkin war strategy we r talkin inna dog fight n flat out super maneuverability an SU-37 would crush an F-22. The terminator ALSO has forward canards in front of the wings 4 forward air deflection, so pretty much the plane can face in the opposite direction n still maintain forward flight. IT can out turn a Raptor by 10-15percent

Posted by
browns (1)
Edit
RE: f-22 vs su-37
Posted: December 7, 2010 (7:11 AM)
Right but now a days you don't get close enough that it matters considering you can shoot somebody down from miles away and be dead before you even know you were in danger.
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